[Mod note: this discussion developed in response to Robinson's almost but not quite transfer from Wigan to AC Milan at the end of the Jan 2020 transfer window. It was moved from Yanks Abroad to the National Team forum.] Maybe the silver lining is that this will alert dumbass Berhalter to the fact that he’s head and shoulders above Daniel f’ing Lovitz.
Saved a youngster a trans atlantic trip as they get on with their new club. I suspect he will be there for the euro friendly.
yeah, not buying that at all. Hooves = horses not zebras. Everyone wants to bring our young guys for Olympic qualification and we don’t hear this stuff then....
New club? He played for Wigan on loan last year. The transfer might be official this year but it’s not a new club. 3g didn’t rate him that’s why he wasn’t there. Same with Holmes. 3g has an MLS bias and it’s clear as day.
Ok, missed that. Last time he played for US was Oct 2018 which if it is game I remember he wasn't all that hot. Then he busted up his ankle and he was out for 4 months. Came back late in second half in 2019. I don't think he has missed much especially GC. But, if it is all MLS bias, then obviously Lovitz it is! But, I won't be surprised at all that the WC squad (if qualified, knock on wood) is going to be very different than the MLS fear folk think.
Let’s not forget that he also wasn’t invited to the u24 camps and there were posters here saying that vines was clearly better....sigh. you’re right our pool is clearly 2/3rd MLS so to have that consistently across camps made sense in 2019. Let’s hope that 2020 is better.
If we make it yes it will be but that’s cause most of 3Gs favorites will have aged out or been clearly passed by players plying their trade in better leagues. The issue is he continues to give them chance after chance when there are better players. The amount of time wasted on Lovitz, Roldan, Zardes, Baird, Trapp, Bradley is just crazy.
Not calling a player up for a continental tournament is basically the definition of thinking his competition is better.
None of the players you listed here should ever don a USMNT jersey again IMO. We know who they are and it is not good enough. At each position they man you can find at least two younger players that could play as well as them if not better even considering their lack of reps at the senior level. I can forgive a few of these during this last window because he couldn't call in the majority of Euro players... but in a meaningful game?... Just forget these guys.
I agree except that Gyasi Zardes still has a role with the USMNT. That’s how bad the forward situation is (excluding Sargent) I mean if we had just decent prospects, I’d say definitely he shouldn’t be there. But who’s the next guy? Brandon Vasquez? Maybe it’s a little better than that but not by much. For instance, Sebastian Soto has fallen off a cliff. I don’t even consider Bobby Wood a soccer player anymore. Maybe we could say Jeremy Ebobisse or Mason Toye - and they should get a look, but I’m not holding my breath. And, calling up Haji Wright, Andrija Novakovich, Christian Ramirez, etc is almost equivalent to probably calling up Daniel Lovitz. Who knows? Jordan Siebatcheu could be solid, but he hasn’t scored a goal this season, I believe. Let’s pray that Jesus Ferreira is with a damn. Point is that our center forwards are atrocious. Gyasi might just be the least terrible. At least he gets lucky from time to time. Now, I don’t know why Cristian Roldan has failed so miserably at the international level. But at this point, I’d rather go back to Kelyn Acosta or Marky Delgado over him. At least they have had moments on the international level. It seems like Roldan is trying to be the worst player on the field every time he steps on the field. Wil Trapp had his shot too and has also consistently failed to impress. And without a doubt, we should never see Lovitz, Baird, and Bradley again.
Joking right? We had critical matches with Canada, the humiliating loss, and the ridiculous, "make things right again" victory, and he was called in for neither. He had no freaking idea what he's doing when it comes to evaluating talent. Your excuses for his incompetence could fly as far as last March, but after March, he continued to push forward w/the same hideous 23's and 11's in what five or six different camps? It's incompetence. Period.
It's pretty scary. I may have drastically overrated Soto, but I also think the Soto problem is at least half, he wants out, and they already lost Gloster and decided to make an example of him. He may not be good, may not have the work rate, or maybe he just fell out of favor because he wanted his transfer and Hannover (I think it's Hannover) got sick of his act and decided to just plant him on the bench as a punishment since they don't see any chance of getting value out of him since he wants out and his market isn't huge (although supposedly Chile was sniffing around him). Personally, considering the situation, I'm all over Nova, Sargent, Toye, Ferreira (butchering that name), Siebatcheu, Pepi, Soto, Ocampo-Chavez etc and I just go young. I guess we can add Zardes, since he does have that freakish ability to get in situations to score w/remarkable regularity even though his deliberate finishing (not scoring with the bag of his head, his arse, his fanny pack, whatever) is garbage. If nothing else he could create potential rebounds for others to finish with his terrible shots. But yeah, I'd just go young, period, throw them out there. What do we have to lose? The other options are even worse.
That was my point. Bravo is certainly in the know so I value his opinion.... and striker is certainly our most uncertain position... even when you include Sargent. But Zardes really brings very little to the table at this point. I will agree that if there is anyone on that list that could stay on the team it is him... but not because of any real skill that he shows... rather just the lackthereof across the board for us at striker. In short, I would rather bite the bullet now and have Sargent as our number one and see if any of the young guys you listed can rise to the occasion.
I appreciate the comment! One thing that might have to happen is to change from the current trend of having a starting central striker and move towards two technical forwards who know how to move into space with speed and skill. For instance, while forward looks like a wasteland... although hopefully the situation changes to Sargent, Weah, and Soto resurrecting his career. And maybe one or two others. Put them up there with someone like Morris, Boyd, Arriola, Ferreira, Llanez, Busio, Miljevic, Sabbi, Pulisic, Reyna, Konrad, and Vassilev. In other words, go with a 424 “empty bucket” type formation. ———-LF———RF———— LW——————————RW ———-CM——-CM————- LB——————————RB ———-CB———-CB———- that could look like... GK Steffen RB Dest, Cannon, Yedlin, Chandler CB Brooks CB Long, Zimmerman, Miazga, etc. LB Robinson, Dest MF McKennie (Morales, Yuiell, etc back up) MF Adams RW/RAM Reyna, Chandler, Lletget, Ledezma, Konrad, Busio, Morris, Arriola, Boyd, Sabbi, Llanez LW/LAM Pulisic RF/ST Sargent, Weah, Soto, Altidore, Siebatcheu, Zardes, (or one listed below) LF/CF Ferreira, Reyna, Lletget, Ledezma, Konrad, Busio, Llanez
I have zero issue with that. He isn't the future. I just dread the inept kind of pragmatism coaches like Berhalter exercise in a short sited devotion to vets and what they're familiar with because they have understood and clear floors, rather than players that may have floors so low, they end up having career changes. In our case, I just think it's like the USSF is one of those comically stupid owners and organizations where they keep on the GM/HC an extra year, w/the stern warning or dreaded vote of confidence in place so everyone and their mother knows that they'll be s canned if they fail. So as a result, the GM/HC are thus motivated to act in a very short sited sense to guarantee their paycheck as long as possible which usually results in many of those classic, "Worst Trade Ever" articles i various sports. You NEVER ever want a coach w/GM power, or a GM on a win or else contract situation because they'll make hideous short term decisions wrecking your long term potential. Berhalter is kind of operating that way, erring towards vets, erring towards familiar MLS options he saw play a lot while coaching, not risking things w/players he hasn't seen in person, or rarely seen in person at all. It just screams, "grabbing the known, low floor" over risking the "unknown" potential guy. The only possible reasons I can see for Holmes to have been banished are: #1 Berhalter is dog ---- at evaluating talent (check) #2 Berhalter has a moronic, "play in the big league, or forget it" rule in place (kinda check). #3 Was Holmes taking to task a teammate in the game for a bad pass actually instead of being a welcome sign of leadership and demanding the best of teammates, instead seen as showing up teammates and indicative of someone that didn't pass the "chemistry" test a la Geoff Cameron? We haven't talked about it, but whenever a player isn't called up, who obviously should be, I always wonder if it's this #3 thing and we just don't know about it because it's behind closed doors/locker room talk so to speak (no idea if it's check) Anyway, I'm definitely in favor of chucking the old crappy tired options, including Zardes, but I'm sure that Berhalter wants a Forward in the group that he knows backwards and forwards, and can execute his system until we have like 3 or 4 tyler adams type talents that play forward to replace him. Until at least 2-3 other forward options announce themselves dramatically, I think we're stuck with Zardes call ups. Nothing good is happening with Nova, Soto, Wood, Wright or Siebatcheu. We're basically dipping into Ocampo-Chavez and Pepi territory after that other than Sargent, and Ferreira. I also should add guys like Toye, and Ebobbisse to the discussion but yeah, right now, it's a house of horrors at Forward w/even Sargent essentially playing like Donovan described feeling like circa 1999-2001. But yeah, my march Forward call ups would probably be Sargent, Ferreira (Im just gonna spell it differently every time til I get it right), Ebob, and Siebatcheu if he's willing to come, Toye would also be in the discussion. I keep forgetting to mention Weah whose basically a wing forward in a 4-3-3 to me, or a Forward in a 4-4-2. I don't view him as a midfielder. So I should've mentioned him. I also think Siebatcheu, if we could get him, could easily prove to be the best forward on the team. He's stuck, like Weah was on PSG, on a team that's threatening to land a Champions League Ticket (currently 3rd in ligue 1), and is running w/what got them there, rather than worrying about blooding him into the side as anything other than a late game sub, and if you're Rennes, and you're doing as well as they are, it makes sense, and isn't an indictment of Siebatcheu. But I could be just hyperventilating over an unknown prospect, he got 17 goals in 34ish games with Reims a few years ago, but since he moved to Rennes he's been completely and utterly glued to the bench. 10 Mill move, so it's definitely disappointing, though based on that recent interview, it definitely made team USA a bigger option to him than the likely total pipe dream that is an international career in France.
NBC sports has an article linking Robinson with a summer deal to Chelsea. A couple of other teams also interested.
i thought his crossing was excellent when first brought in -- and juxtaposed him with players like yedlin for this purpose. i think there's "running forward" and then there's "precision." but then he had defensive issues against top teams and was less precise. if he's back to operating order i think we are underrating the value of a cross EXACTLY where we want it, as opposed to in the stands or even leading or over the head of the guy a foot. that being said, he still has the defending issues, and club snobs tend to have an almost childlike naivete about the reasons players like this can get signed. the first hint something is amiss should be when On Loan From Chelsea gets interested. i'm also amused someone fails a physical and the part you're listening to is was almost signed by ________. i'd be curious why he failed the physical. it's all academic unless he's loaned within england someplace. we're past the window to go out of border and we'd have to see if they still care in the summer.
Since we dont have any world class defenders in the pool.......I think most of our players will have defensive issues against top class opposition at some point. Apparently, he didnt get the paperwork through on time. There is no indication that its an actual physical problem. Unless you have different information from whats been reported.
https://wiganathletic.com/news/2020/january/Club-Statement-Antonee-Robinson/ "Robinson, 22, travelled to Milan this morning after the two clubs agreed a fee for the permanent transfer on Thursday evening. The USA international underwent a medical examination with AC Milan, though further medical tests with the Italian authorities were required, which were subject to a 72-hour deadline. As such, the deal could not be formally ratified before the 8pm Italian Transfer Deadline on Friday."
I dont see anything alarming here. Sounds like the interest was late in the transfer window and he was unable to get the testing done before the deadline. I doubt he would have interest from Villa, Chelsea and Newcastle after the fact. Surely they would do the minimal amount of homework to find out if a medical issue was at hand. If there were a problem, it has to be minor for clubs to be eyeing him for the next summer transfer window.
interestingly, it's the club snobs who go all over the place on these things. they will play this up into superstardom in the buildup, and then when it turns out to be an asset to loan around, turn on the player for "not taking advantage of the opportunity." meanwhile i will be the one steadily saying there's no way a second division guy who couldn't make everton is being chased by ACM or CFC to actually play there, and that if he's being signed it's to loan back out, this was the original point and not a reflection on him other than their assessment was buy to loan not buy to use. bears reminding he's 22 not some age grouper. this is just common sense, decent player going forward, defensive flaws, couldn't make everton, finds level in second division finally. if the top of the first division in england and italy comes calling, skepticism is begged. maybe he thinks GB forgot my phone number so what does it matter if i am starting or not? they will offer me a ton of money to go on loans for a few years. not that different than his everton career. if he signs in england maybe he's loaned back down to close to wigan anyway.
finer point, the excuses bunch are always like, but, you're not going to have to play douglas costa every week, give him a break. perhaps, unless you happen to sign for a team that plays juventus at least twice a season......