I absolutely agree that Foden is an extremely overrated player. Maybe in the next matches he will prove me wrong but today I am convinced of it. I don't follow the Premier League with much continuity but every time I see him in important Champions League matches or even in these first two matches with the national team he never makes a good impression on me. He seems like a player who is absent a lot during the 90 minutes.
Spain is extremely impressive. I love how they play. Again... LAMINE YAMAL. All these kids are great, but one stands above them all imo. The most talented since Neymar for sure.
Spain is very strong but always seems to have the same flaw, they struggle to finish off the many chances they create. Donnarumma was definitely Italy's man of the match, Di Lorenzo the worst. From Spain I would say Williams and Cucurella
I dont see how another player doing well changes the fact that a 16 year old after one professional season is this good. In 2, 3 years Yamal will be better than Ruiz ever was or will be. I get that it can be confusing to see a tree from the forrest. There has always been great talents in the world of football, many of which don't become great (that I myself have been vocal about on the forum like Ansu Fati), but there are early indicators of great talent that can not be ignored. One of which is a playmaking ability and Yamal is already one of the best playmakers in the world. He has a great football IQ. It is seen in a way he plays. He doesnt rush, he doesnt force things, he doesnt make bad decisions, he doesnt shy away from the ball... He will only get better physically, technically, mentally. Of course career is long and a lot can happen. There are also question marks about his dedication to craft, but one things is for sure, Lamine Yamal knows the ball - as people would say these days.
Few things about that: 1. The whole point of evaluating players on a scale such as from 1 to 10 is to standardize those ratings so they can be compared amongst each other. Taking into account a subjective strength-meter to base ratings on is straightout unfair and beats the purpose of the whole thing. What someone expects of a team is completely subjective and it usually varies by a lot amongst people. I am not sure whether you are just pointing out why the discrepency happened or are you trying to justify it, but however, that is why I made the second point: 2. Switzerland played against Scotland, which is in a similar boat as Albania, and have apparently (havent seen the game) performed worse than Croatia. What is a rationale to rate Switzerland's players so much higher than Croatians? It is not just a matter of expectations for each team, but there is an arbitrary application of criteria. That is much worse. What I think played a big factor is the first and the last impression of the game. This is usually how people form their opinion. First impression sets the tone for what ratings might look like and the last impression is a lasting impression. Croatia sucked at both. Everything in the middle of the game is less noticable and less trackable so it ultimately makes lesser impact on subjective ratings.
Denmark 1-1 England - Stodgy Three Lions limp to Euro 2024 draw after Morten Hjulmand stunner - TNT Sports Denmark: Schmeichel 6; Andersen 6, Christensen 6, Vestergaard 6; Maehle 6, Hojbjerg 8*, Hjulmand 7, Kristiansen 5; Eriksen 7; Hojlund 6, Wind 6. Subs: Damshaard 7, Poulsen 6, Bah 6, Skov Olsen 6, Nrgaard 6. England: Pickford 6; Walker 6, Stones 6, Guehi 7, Trippier 6; Alexander-Arnold 6, Rice 5; Saka 7, Bellingham 6, Foden 7; Kane 6. Subs: Gallagher 6, Eze 6, Watkins 6, Bowen 6. Slovenia 1-1 Serbia - Serbia stay alive after Luka Jovic scores last-second equaliser against Slovenia - TNT Sports Slovenia: Oblak 7. Karnicnik 9*, Drkusic 7, Bijol 7, Janza 8. Stojanovic 7, Gnezda Cerin 7, Elsnik 8, Mlakar 7. Sporar 6, Sesko 7. Subs: Stankovic 6, Verbic 5, Vipotnik 5, Brekalo N/A. Serbia: Rajkovic 6, Veljkovic 6, Milenkovic 6, Pavlovic 7. Zivkovic 7, Ilic 6, Tadic 8, Lukic 7, Mladenovic 5. Vlahovic 6, Mitrovic 8. Subs: Gacinovic 5, Jovic 8, Milinkovic-Savic 6, Birmancevic 6, Samardzic 5. Spain 1-0 Italy - Riccardo Calafiori own-goal sends Spain into Euro 2024 knockouts with comfortable win - TNT Sports Spain: Simon 6, Carvajal 7, Le Normand 7, Morata 7, Ruiz 7, Laporte 7, Rodri 7, Williams 9, Yamal 8, Pedri 8, Cucurella 8 Subs: Baena 6, Oyarzabal 6, Perez 6, Torres 6 Italy: Donnarumma 8, Di Lorenzo 5, Dimarco 5, Calafiori 5, Frattesi 5, Jorginho 5, Scamacca 5, Pellegrini 5, Chiesa 5, Barella 5, Bastoni 5 Subs: Cristante 6, Cambiaso 6, Retegui 6, Raspadori 6, Zaccagni 6 I tend to think, for entertainment ratings, I might go down to a straight 6 this time (having been pretty close to saying that a few times before...but not for Denmark vs Slovenia or England vs Serbia either as like I said I was erring more to go higher rather than lower if anything for those games) for Slovenia vs Serbia, while going 6.5 for England vs Denmark (as high as that moreso due to Denmark's play overall to be honest), and 7 for Spain vs Italy (mostly due to Spain). One interesting thing for me (as a follow-up to my "don't let Sesko shoot" comment) was that Sesko was shooting in the way he was - often I will even prefer/enjoy more the accurate finishes to the top corner than the power strikes myself, but going that way does seem like the wrong choice for him (albeit he didn't actually score vs Denmark with his efforts and maybe he was trying to be more careful/accurate) as he just seems much more likely to pull off a drive with a free swinging leg than he does trying to place a ball into the top corner with finesse. He has a couple of attempts where he could have gone with power more but chose to try and place the ball I noticed. I did think the moment he was brought down when he had a clear run on goal was a bit dubious though (with the free-kick being awarded for an earlier foul - I guess it was a case of the ref playing an advantage that didn't arise at first, but it only didn't arise because of a foul so I'd think that's the foul that should be dealt with even if it might lead to a 'soft' red card in terms of the severity of the foul which could have been in his mind I suppose). I do kind of agree on England players tending to get a bit over-hyped (albeit it's true the likes of Saka, Foden, Bellingham have been playing prominent roles at leading clubs of late obviously, and Rice even before he left West Ham had become a bit more rounded and I suppose the price tag reflects a bit just how much teams pay for players nowadays to an extent too - even Kane is I suppose, and always was, in some ways limited, but on the other hand in certain respects he became and still remains top notch, as a scorer, and also a passer which is an aspect which isn't being utilised I suppose in the role he's playing atm). I kind of wonder whether taking out Rice as well as TAA (unless trying TAA as right back), and putting Mainoo and Wharton together, to try to make the play more cohesive from the base of midfield, would be the best way now. I kind of wonder whether, even after some less impressive form (which makes it understandable they got left out the squad) missing Rashford and/or Sterling is meaning missing something in terms of outlets as wing forward type players (that might suit Kane better). Whether Watkins should get a chance in tandem with Kane, as opposed to instead of him. Whether Maddison should get involved in the games (Bellingham obviously can go deeper too), albeit with less pace than Foden has he even offers less of an attacking outlet as runner/dribbler too (with Palmer it's not quite the same but he's more someone to come to the ball and link play than to run in behind himself as well). It's not an easy puzzle to solve maybe, but I guess something has to change if they are to have a chance at the trophy (that many thought they did before the tournament), even if at times teams have won trophies without playing great football I suppose....
Every human being is biased and so are journalists, so you actually need a fair amount of different sources to get a realistic picture of which player delivered and who didn't. I'm quite busy right now so the averages I publish during the first stage include just 7 or 9 sources (avoiding 8, since I don't want .25 or .75 fractions). La Gazzetta dello Sport is a reliable source, but occasionally they do get things very wrong so one always has to remember that the pink one is not a Bible.
I just realised James Maddison was one of the players cut from England's squad in the final selections, so ignore the part of my post where I mention him lol!
Can GdS and Guerin ratings from Euro 2024 or older leagues and Serie A be found anywhere on the internet?
John Stones as well for me. When he became a poor man's Beckenbauer, Baresi or Krol he suddenly entered a different stratosphere (I'd take a Kompany at his pomp, before the injuries that wrecked his timing, over him). The problems and limitations with playing like that was visible in the 2023 CL final. It just didn't work. The only thing is that then, while losing the ball without pressure, mistiming challenges, a slight positional error and such aren't directly lethal any more. Comparisons with Van Dijk are also off the mark for me, the latter at his prime (before a fired up Pickford from the rival Everton assaulted his knee - that's a lot worse than an ACL without violent force by an opponent) was a true stand out in the 2018 and 2019 CL finals (as well as the semi final vs Rome in 2018 with the goals and Barcelona 2019), and was tested on both occasions. With an insight to prevent danger before it occurs and who can/could also do a croquetta and dribble (through the middle, sideline) when necessary (the criticism of folks like Gullit and MvB was "I am convinced he can do more than he shows"). And was/is one of the most frequent passers in EPL history, since they started recording. But hey, all of this sells the product at home and in the Commonwealth. Sound maybe too harsh and too negative and there are also some players who pass the test for me (Kane, Saka, Bellingham to name three; Walker on his best days as well to name a fourth, can play CB).
Guerin you can find a few things online, the GDS once had a kind of archive but it now seems to be no longer in operation.
End of the first half; I am unhappy with the yellow card for Van Dijk. Very unfair. His foot was stepped upon, not the other way around. Anthony Taylor on duty (Taylor... the name of the 1974 final - will there be a Thomas as well?). That can be costly - you need his 'leadership' (signals, communication). The Portuguese referee of the first match was however a lot worse. France (a bit) better so far. That is no shame. We miss a proper midfield. Koop, FDJ, also Veerman (at his best) but part of the reason why he doesn't play is because he is on a yellow (was also harsh - others could make multiple fouls and worse fouls). You might need him for the 3rd game vs Austria and the round of 16. My expectations were worse than this - based on some recent encounters, the pace of France, and the current personnel. Koeman is not great (probably) and we don't have the staff and money of France. Some good/great opportunities for us too. Frimpong I like and also that he has chosen to play for us (he says he feels Dutch and Holland/Amsterdam provided his family the chances for safety and prosperity). Of the big countries, France is usually a team I like most (or 2nd most). If they equal Germany and Spain their count of euro wins, in Germany, I am not unhappy. For some reason I was also before 2010 final (in case some think this) not *that* fond of Spain. I wouldn't play De Vrij right now. De Ligt or Van de Ven please (Ake can play CB too). Quicker and stronger. De Vrij is now not a certain starter for Inter any more; sometimes plays big games, sometimes not. Losing against France creates a better path. edit: the expansion to five subs really favors the bigger teams. At 70 minutes now and Koeman needs to bring on some fresh legs. Hasn't done yet.
Goal chalked off even on the ref forum they say "subjective call". Premier League has not the best VARs. https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/match-20-ned-fra-taylor-eng.2131068/ The VARs during Ajax their 2018-19 CL run were a lot more wrong, I have to say. There I really felt they, the money machines, didn't want them to win (a club I don't support). Not now, even though Taylor is not very very good and the harsh yellow is costly. edit: if it is not Holland or Belgium, I'll be supporting France. I am now convinced. Like it also how they are interfering in the upcoming elections.
Virgil and Ake the two best Oranje players for me (GK Verbruggen with some important interventions). Cannot wait for the hitjob in the ratings and the innate assumption in certain circles that some Oranje players just cannot be ranked alongside/ahead of the modern players from bigger nations. De Vrij should be benched. We really miss Frenkie. De Bruyne has actually a good rating at Sofascore (7.7 rating). I think that does him more justice, without being MOTM contender or anything, than the below 5 ratings of certain publications (which they didn't do, to this degree, with someone as Pirlo when his team 'flopped' at a few major tournaments, and who has not really better Sofascore ratings). KDB is maybe a bit past his peak now. He is getting older and has an injury record. France was better. In the second half Koeman played to not lose the game. He admitted it. France finishing ahead in the group is not bad. Maybe nick a goal (almost succeeded). Allez les blue!
5 for Yamal is crazy. I dont quite understand 6.5 for Rodri as well. I am a broken record at this point, but I am less and less intrigued by their ratings. He had that one misplaced pass that led to a shot (after a knock in the second half), other than that I would have assumed that newspapers would have a more nuanced understanding of football and would capture qualitative impact that stats dont. But it seems it is just more of the same. Rodri won plenty of difficult 1st and 2nd balls and secured posession with impaccavle positioning and technique which then is a foundation for all these players to do something forward. Spain is extremely lucky to have him. Real talk, was Sergio Busquets ever this good? Rodri in 70th match of the season btw pic.twitter.com/d7G1jct1SF— Saul (@MCFC_Saul) June 21, 2024
Verbruggen the best rated player, like Maignan. Okay then. 97.5 - @OnsOranje's Bart Verbruggen completed 97.5 percent of his passes against France (39/40), the highest accuracy for any goalkeeper with at least 40 passes on record in a match at the European Championship (since 1980). Tidy. pic.twitter.com/bqksq7XgC1— OptaJohan (@OptaJohan) June 21, 2024 Some other puzzling ratings. Dumfries is the only one of the defense who fails, but then also Rabiot fails and Hernandez fails. His direct opponents. Despite the atmosphere here I thought I could see that well. Griezmann a 5 - ask Reijnders what problems he caused with his movements. You might say he could have done better with the finishing but the chances weren't that big. Before HT France accumulated an Xg of 0.3, after full-time around 1.5. That is not enormous. If that Simons goal is not chalked off, Oranje has around the same Xg (or close). Plus, if you do more work, it is harder to be sharp with the finishing. It is not like being Inzaghi or Aguero. I thought our midfield was pretty decent against a great opponent, even though the two/three best didn't play (FDJ, Koop, Veerman saved because of his yellow card). The problem is really the attack. "We don’t know why this is. If we knew we would fix it. Most people think it is to do with the coaching, that young players are not able to be as free anymore; that there are too many restrictions and it is always ‘move the ball, pass the ball, don’t dribble with the ball’. It is down to the youth departments, but we don’t know precisely.”" https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/06/15/netherlands-striker-euro-2024-koeman-weghorst-depay/ I think it does not help many slick young (and physically sound) attackers leave the country very early. When they are 16 or younger. The midfield and defense generally stays in the native academies and league until their early or even mid-20s. The exception is Aké. Now there is among the attackers Zirkzee who might come good (as a 17-19 year old he scored some important goals for Bayern Munich). Also Xavi Simons. Many look at him with suspicion because of his YouTube career as youngster, but I think that was maybe smart. Foreign academies prioritize their own boys (or at best a fancy Brazilian). Whether it is Foden from nearby or the production line of Barcelona youngsters. It was maybe smart to create a name and standing for yourself, and then he decided to leave the Barcelona academy. Because he and his dad felt he would not be given an equal chance and equal opportunity. Like Zirkzee, he can also become good - in Sofascore and WhoScored he is already for the Bundesliga (very high up). He has the reputation though of being 50-75% the player for the national team. I don't say he is there already. Koeman his comments were fair I think: "Despite disagreeing with the decision, Koeman - who said he spoke to Taylor in the dressing room afterwards - said he could accept the outcome and was satisfied with a draw that leaves the Netherlands on four points after two games and in a strong position to reach the last 16. "France had better chances but not that many more," he added. "I personally thought the goal should have stood, therefore my takeaway from this is it is a fair result – I can accept this. "There were times during the game where we weren’t up to scratch and that is probably due to the fact we were up against a great opponent." https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/articles/c722px74pepo But that underlines the Griezmann rating makes little sense for me. Also he was not playing against Albania, Hungary or Scotland. Indeed, he was playing against some (relatively) highly rated defenders. https://www.thetimes.com/sport/foot...nce-can-make-it-1988-all-over-again-6cwhn8lbh (Though that column does say the columnist is in the minority when it comes to whether that will be sufficient) A better attack makes it easier for the midfielders. Say, with Haaland up top you can also reach a higher ceiling, and make breaking passes, as midfielder. Depay now is not the Depay of 2021.
Netherlands 0-0 France: Kylian Mbappe stays on bench as VAR controversy sees Xavi Simons goal ruled out - TNT Sports Netherlands: Verbruggen 7, Dumfries 6, De Vrij 6, Van Dijk 6, Ake 5, Schouten 5, Reijnders 6, Frimpong 6, Simons 7, Gakpo 6, Depay 4. Subs: Geertruida 5, Wijnaldum 6, Veerman 5, Weghorst 5. France: Maignan 7, Kounde 6, Upamecano 7, Saliba 6, Hernandez 5, Kante 7, Tchouameni 6, Rabiot 5, Dembele 5, Griezmann 6, Thuram 4. Subs: Coman 4, Giroud 5 Poland 1-3 Austria: Marko Arnautovic on target as Ralf Rangnick's side boost Euro 2024 knockout chances, Poles exit - TNT Sports POLAND: Szczesny 7, Bednarek 6, Dawidowicz 6, Kiwior 6, Frankowski 6, Piotrowski 5, Slisz 6, Zalewski 7, Zielinski 7, Buksa 6, Piatek 7. Subs: Moder 6, Swiderski 6, Lewandowski 6, Grosicki 6. AUSTRIA: Pentz 7, Posch 8, Trauner 8, Lienhart 8, Mwene 8, Seiwald 8, Grillitsch 7, Baumgartner 9*, Laimer 9, Sabitzer 9, Arnautovic 8. Subs: Wimmer 7, Danso 6, Prass 6, Schmid n/a, Gregoritsch n/a Slovakia 1-2 Ukraine: Roman Yaremchuk wonder strike seals precious comeback victory at Euro 2024 - TNT Sports Slovakia: Dubravka 6, Pekarik 6, Vavro 6, Skriniar 6, Hancko 6, Kucka 6, Lobotka 7, Duda 6, Schranz 7, Bozenik 6, Haraslin 8 Subs: Benes 6, Strelec 6, Obert 6, Suslov 6, Sauer N/A Ukraine: Trubin 7, Tymchyk 6, Zabaryni 6, Matviienko 6, Zinchenko 8, Brazhko 7, Shaparenko 8, Yarmolenko 6, Sudakov 7, Mudryk 7, Dovbyk 6 Subs: Zubkov 6, Yaremchuk 8, Malinovskyi N/A, Sydorchuk N/A, Talovierov N/A I think I'd give an entertainment rating of 6 for Slovakia vs Ukraine, and I was thinking I might be heading to that for Poland vs Austria too but in the end I'd comfortably go with 6.5, and probably I'd settle on 6.5 for the Netherlands-France game too I reckon, all things considered. One thing I feel like I'm noticing (without thinking deeply about how unusual it would be - it makes sense in a way too but for sure it doesn't always happen at least) is that quite a few of the top performers and stars of the first games are carrying that on into the second games too. I think I'm going to be more comfortable keeping a 'Team of the Tournament' XI attempt adjusted as the games go by rather than an XI for each matchday, but I think there probably aren't likely to be very many changes between how I have it after the opening group games and after the second group games. Bit unsure re: defence (I'll look at how the Turkish right back does assuming he plays again in their second game, but I'm feeling like Kimmich might have a chance to take the place I'd given to him, and things are still uncertain/up for grabs for the rest of the defence maybe) but Kante, Fabian Ruiz, Musiala seem very likely to be there and probably Gundogan too, and atm I tend to think it's quite likely Verbruggen retains his place too (Gakpo might have a chance to enter the XI based on a combination of both games - (likewise I'll be keeping my eyes on the Turkey game on that one like I said re: Kimmich too) - assuming I keep Musiala on the right in the 4-2-3-1 or 4-3-2-1 system; maybe I will be replacing Wind but I'm not really sure who with at the moment).
What? There are 12 players rated 5 or lower in the Netheralnds vs France match while there are combined 1 player rated 5 or lower in Poland vs Austria and Slovakia vs Ukraine matches. I haven't seen games, but what did I miss? How is this possible? Ridiculous expectations again or?
The Austrian players have been rated excessively high I would say (and the Poland players not in a harsh way in comparison to the Netherlands/France ratings), though I get why the performance was received positively. In France vs Netherlands I guess it's a mixture of the expectations and the fact there were various missed chances that players can be downgraded for specifically. It does seem a bit strange though yes.
They were over here negative too (Van Hooijdonk - the former Forest player and free kick master). I saw now this morning Fabregas was at half-time on the BBC positive about Holland. He said there is good movement and agility, "technically very good". Sharp in transitions. Only Depay was questioned and that he misses the legs. And France is of course France. France could have won every tournament since 2016, without illnesses and also without Pogba thinking he was playing for Switzerland (in 2021).